Discussion:
What did Bob Dylan mean by "Siamese Cat"?
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b***@yahoo.com
2005-08-28 17:54:33 UTC
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What did Bob Dylan mean by saying "Siamese Cat" in "Like a Rolling
Stone"?

Bradwell Jackson
j***@lycosmonaut.com
2005-08-28 18:06:04 UTC
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Post by b***@yahoo.com
What did Bob Dylan mean by saying "Siamese Cat" in "Like a Rolling
Stone"?
If that's the only Dylan line or phrase that you don't know the meaning
of, then you're not getting your money's worth.

(IIRC, the "Siamese Cat" was Buddy Holly. Or am I confusing LaRS with
"American Pie"?)
Rick Wotnaz
2005-08-28 18:13:50 UTC
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Post by b***@yahoo.com
What did Bob Dylan mean by saying "Siamese Cat" in "Like a
Rolling
Stone"?
I believe he meant "Siamese Cat". As with many another Dylan line, it
was a moderately random phrase with the right meter and rhyme to fit
the rest of the song. Once he'd chosen to end one line with
"diplomat", he had to cast around for something that rhymed and he'd
already used "pillbox hat".
--
rzed
DianeE
2005-08-28 19:38:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rick Wotnaz
Post by b***@yahoo.com
What did Bob Dylan mean by saying "Siamese Cat" in "Like a Rolling
Stone"?
I believe he meant "Siamese Cat". As with many another Dylan line, it
was a moderately random phrase with the right meter and rhyme to fit
the rest of the song. Once he'd chosen to end one line with
"diplomat", he had to cast around for something that rhymed and he'd
already used "pillbox hat".
----------
Interestingly, a few years earlier, Chuck Berry, in "Nadine," had rhymed
"diplomat" with "where she's at."

DianeE
Delbert Stanley
2005-08-28 21:02:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by Rick Wotnaz
Post by b***@yahoo.com
What did Bob Dylan mean by saying "Siamese Cat" in "Like a
Rolling
Stone"?
I believe he meant "Siamese Cat". As with many another Dylan line, it
was a moderately random phrase with the right meter and rhyme to fit
the rest of the song. Once he'd chosen to end one line with
"diplomat", he had to cast around for something that rhymed and he'd
already used "pillbox hat".
Perhaps he intended to close with Siamese Cat and backed into
"diplomat". Couldn't "diplomat" be the rhyme plug throwout?
Rick Wotnaz
2005-08-29 01:58:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Delbert Stanley
Post by Rick Wotnaz
Post by b***@yahoo.com
What did Bob Dylan mean by saying "Siamese Cat" in "Like a Rolling
Stone"?
I believe he meant "Siamese Cat". As with many another Dylan
line, it was a moderately random phrase with the right meter
and rhyme to fit the rest of the song. Once he'd chosen to end
one line with "diplomat", he had to cast around for something
that rhymed and he'd already used "pillbox hat".
Perhaps he intended to close with Siamese Cat and backed into
"diplomat". Couldn't "diplomat" be the rhyme plug throwout?
*Could* be, sure. Why not? But here are the lines:

"You used to ride on the chrome horse with your diplomat
Who carried on his shoulder a Siamese cat"

The "Siamese Cat" line seems awkward to me, an unnatural way to
express the concept (in conversation, wouldn't you way "...carried
a Siamese Cat on his shoulder"?), as though that were the line
shoehorned into the rhyme scheme. But what do I know? The more
normal way of putting it wouldn't fit the rhythm, so maybe that's
reason enough to reshuffle it.
--
rzed
DianeE
2005-08-28 19:39:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by b***@yahoo.com
What did Bob Dylan mean by saying "Siamese Cat" in "Like a Rolling
Stone"?
------------
The Siamese is a small breed, ergo more likely to fit on a human shoulder.

DianeE
Delbert Stanley
2005-08-28 22:14:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by DianeE
Post by b***@yahoo.com
What did Bob Dylan mean by saying "Siamese Cat" in "Like a Rolling
Stone"?
------------
The Siamese is a small breed, ergo more likely to fit on a human shoulder.
But then a Siamese Cat could be a real cool dude from Bangkok :)


Back in the 60s whenever I heard the word Siamese, I would first
think of Siamese twins. When Siamese twins were mentioned
it was always in reference to some freakish human birth.
Connected heads, torsos, two heads, etc.

So when I heard Dylan's song at an impressionable age, I
thought he was calling someone "two-faced", or someone
talking out of both sides his mouth(s). A politician
straight from a Ringling Bros.style circus freak show.

Looking back I guess I wasn't very politically correct in
my thinking. But just prior to that phrase he mentions
clowns and jugglers doing tricks for you. Sure sounds
like a circus environment. Hey, I was set up!

"Did their tricks for you?" Maybe I need to re-think
that one too.
Michael Black
2005-08-28 23:27:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Delbert Stanley
Post by DianeE
Post by b***@yahoo.com
What did Bob Dylan mean by saying "Siamese Cat" in "Like a Rolling
Stone"?
------------
The Siamese is a small breed, ergo more likely to fit on a human shoulder.
But then a Siamese Cat could be a real cool dude from Bangkok :)
Back in the 60s whenever I heard the word Siamese, I would first
think of Siamese twins. When Siamese twins were mentioned
it was always in reference to some freakish human birth.
Connected heads, torsos, two heads, etc.
So when I heard Dylan's song at an impressionable age, I
thought he was calling someone "two-faced", or someone
talking out of both sides his mouth(s). A politician
straight from a Ringling Bros.style circus freak show.
Looking back I guess I wasn't very politically correct in
my thinking. But just prior to that phrase he mentions
clowns and jugglers doing tricks for you. Sure sounds
like a circus environment. Hey, I was set up!
"Did their tricks for you?" Maybe I need to re-think
that one too.
It's been a while since I closely listened to the lyrics, but
I always thought that was about a spoiled kid, previously entertained,
and then suddenly being out on your own and you have to make do for yourself.

I wrote somewhere on the 40th anniversary of the recording in June (or
was that the anniversary of the release?), that in some ways the song
reflects a culture that didn't really take place till a few years later.
At least not to the same extent. It does describe what would be
happening a couple of years later, when kids would become hippies
and all move to San Francisco. It does fit that scenario, though
in 1965 it was a fairly marginal activity.

Michael
Delbert Stanley
2005-08-29 22:01:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Michael Black
Post by Michael Black
I wrote somewhere on the 40th anniversary of the recording in June (or
was that the anniversary of the release?), that in some ways the song
reflects a culture that didn't really take place till a few years later.
At least not to the same extent. It does describe what would be
happening a couple of years later, when kids would become hippies
and all move to San Francisco. It does fit that scenario, though
in 1965 it was a fairly marginal activity.
Michael
I see where PBS is showing a two-parter on early Dylan next
month (Sept. 27 & 28th?). It is part of the American Masters
series. It is directed by Martin Scorsese. Maybe additional
details will be revealed. Probably not, however.
Marc Dashevsky
2005-08-29 23:48:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by Delbert Stanley
I see where PBS is showing a two-parter on early Dylan next
month (Sept. 27 & 28th?). It is part of the American Masters
series. It is directed by Martin Scorsese. Maybe additional
details will be revealed. Probably not, however.
Detail like this? <http://pbs.org/previews/american_masters_dylan>

In an event that has brought together Bob Dylan and Martin Scorsese,
AMERICAN MASTERS presents "Bob Dylan: No Direction Home," airing on
PBS Monday-Tuesday, September 26-27, 2005, 9:00 p.m. ET. Check local
listings. The two-part film, which focuses on the singer-songwriter's
life and music from 1961-66, includes never-seen performance footage
and interviews with artists and musicians whose lives intertwined with
Dylan's during that time. Dylan talks openly and extensively about this
critical period in his career, detailing the journey from his hometown
of Hibbing, Minnesota, to Greenwich Village, New York, where he became
the center of a musical and cultural upheaval, the effects of which
are still felt today.

For the first time, the Bob Dylan Archives has made available rare
treasures from its film, tape and stills collection, including footage
from Murray Lerner's film Festival, documenting performances at the
1963, 1964 and 1965 Newport Folk Festivals; previously unreleased
outtakes from D.A. Pennebaker's famed 1967 documentary Don't Look Back;
and interviews with Allen Ginsberg, Pete Seeger, Joan Baez, Maria
Muldaur and many others. In anticipation of the film, members of
Dylan's worldwide community of fans also contributed rarities from
their own collections.

"Bob Dylan: No Direction Home, A Martin Scorsese Picture" comes on the
heels of Dylan's best-selling memoir, Chronicles: Volume I, which spent
19 weeks on the New York Times Hardcover Non-Fiction Bestseller list.

In addition to directing such dramatic films as Raging Bull, Goodfellas
and The Aviator, Martin Scorsese is an avid chronicler of the history of
American popular music. Most recently, he executive-produced the music
miniseries THE BLUES, which aired on PBS, as well as the related concert
film Lightning in a Bottle, directed by Antoine Fuqua. Scorsese also
directed the documentary The Last Waltz (1978), which captured The
Band's legendary farewell concert, and he served as an assistant
director and editor on Woodstock (1970).

In discussing his excitement about the current project, Scorsese
remarked, "I had been a great fan for many years when I had the
privilege to film Bob Dylan for The Last Waltz. I've admired and
enjoyed his many musical transformations. For me, there is no other
musical artist who weaves his influences so densely to create something
so personal and unique."

Along with Scorsese, "Bob Dylan: No Direction Home" is individually
produced by Jeff Rosen of Grey Water Park, Nigel Sinclair of Spitfire,
Anthony Wall of the BBC's "Arena" series and Susan Lacy of Thirteen/WNET
New York's AMERICAN MASTERS series, which has won the Emmy for
Outstanding Primetime Non-Fiction Series five of the last six years.

"When we first began discussing this project years ago, we were over-
whelmed by the material at hand - home movies and history-making concert
footage, fascinating interviews with Dylan's friends and fellow
performers and, of course, Dylan himself, speaking so frankly about this
incredible period in his life," said Lacy, series creator and executive
producer of AMERICAN MASTERS. "What we needed--above all--was an artist
with a singular vision who could fuse this material into a unique visual
narrative. That artist was Martin Scorsese, who graciously agreed
to direct."

Added Spitfire's Sinclair, "Bob Dylan is a true cultural worldwide icon.
This is the first time Bob has given this unprecedented access, which,
coupled with Marty's outstanding filmmaking talents, should provide an
unparalleled portrait of Dylan's indelible mark on the culture of the
20th century."

Part one of "Bob Dylan: No Direction Home" will also premiere on
September 26 in the UK, on the internationally prestigious series
"Arena." on the BBC. This will be a historic collaboration between
the world's two principal public broadcasters.

"This is history," said Wall, "Arena" series editor. "As Dylan's
extraordinary career is building to another great peak, it's also
a milestone for the BBC and PBS."

Paramount Home Entertainment will release a DVD version of the
documentary with extensive additional, never-before-seen footage on
September 20. Apple will present the DVD and international version of
"Bob Dylan: No Direction Home."

The film's soundtrack will be a double CD set comprising key songs in
the film as well as rare and unreleased recordings from 1961 to 1966.
Volume 7 of Bob Dylan's Bootleg Series, No Direction Home: The Sound-
track, is slated for release August 30, on Columbia/Legacy Records.

The Bob Dylan Scrapbook 1956-1966 will be published by Simon & Schuster
on October 1. The book features Dylan's early years, illustrated and
packaged in a slipcased scrapbook complete with rare photographs,
removable documents, reproductions of memorabilia, and a 45-minute CD.
This unique book features interviews, archival photographs, and repro-
ductions of song lyrics, plus other rare materials drawn from the film.
--
Go to http://MarcDashevsky.com to send me e-mail.
(Reunion -- http://ClassicalHigh70.com)
Len Blanks
2005-08-30 00:21:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Marc Dashevsky
I see where PBS is showing a two-parter on early Dylan next month
(Sept. 27 & 28th?). It is part of the American Masters series. It
is directed by Martin Scorsese. Maybe additional details will be
revealed. Probably not, however.
Detail like this? <http://pbs.org/previews/american_masters_dylan>
In an event that has brought together Bob Dylan and Martin Scorsese,
AMERICAN MASTERS presents "Bob Dylan: No Direction Home," airing on
PBS Monday-Tuesday, September 26-27, 2005, 9:00 p.m. ET. Check local
listings. The two-part film, which focuses on the singer-songwriter's
life and music from 1961-66, includes never-seen performance footage
and interviews with artists and musicians whose lives intertwined
with Dylan's during that time. Dylan talks openly and extensively
about this critical period in his career, detailing the journey from
his hometown of Hibbing, Minnesota, to Greenwich Village, New York,
where he became the center of a musical and cultural upheaval, the
effects of which are still felt today.
[...]
Post by Marc Dashevsky
The film's soundtrack will be a double CD set comprising key songs in
the film as well as rare and unreleased recordings from 1961 to 1966.
Volume 7 of Bob Dylan's Bootleg Series, No Direction Home: The Sound-
track, is slated for release August 30, on Columbia/Legacy Records.
The Bob Dylan Scrapbook 1956-1966 will be published by Simon &
Schuster on October 1. The book features Dylan's early years,
illustrated and packaged in a slipcased scrapbook complete with rare
photographs, removable documents, reproductions of memorabilia, and
a 45-minute CD. This unique book features interviews, archival
photographs, and repro- ductions of song lyrics, plus other rare
materials drawn from the film.
This could be a bit more detailed; Siamese Cats are not even mentioned.
--
Len

You play someone a great record and they don't react to it; you know
it's time to get them out of your house -- Miriam Linna
Marc Dashevsky
2005-08-30 02:07:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Len Blanks
This could be a bit more detailed; Siamese Cats are not even mentioned.
Did any cats, Siamese or otherwise, wash up the Mississippi
from New Orleans to Red Stick?
--
Go to http://MarcDashevsky.com to send me e-mail.
(Reunion -- http://ClassicalHigh70.com)
Len Blanks
2005-08-30 17:13:53 UTC
Permalink
No, No. I quoted three paragraphs.
Post by Len Blanks
This could be a bit more detailed; Siamese Cats are not even
mentioned.
Did any cats, Siamese or otherwise, wash up the Mississippi from New
Orleans to Red Stick?
No. Some wind damage, some rain, power out for about five hours.
--
Len

I would like to know what kind of a goddam govment this is that discriminates
between two common carriers and makes a goddam railroad charge everybody equal
and lets a goddam man charge any goddam price he wants to for his goddam opera
box -- William Dean Howells in a letter to the NY Times, 4 Oct 1907
Mark Dintenfass
2005-08-30 00:26:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Marc Dashevsky
Post by Delbert Stanley
I see where PBS is showing a two-parter on early Dylan next
month (Sept. 27 & 28th?). It is part of the American Masters
series. It is directed by Martin Scorsese. Maybe additional
details will be revealed. Probably not, however.
Detail like this? <http://pbs.org/previews/american_masters_dylan>
Thanks for posting this. I'll certainly be watching, though I wish it
were going to cover two or three more years after 1966.
--
--md
_________
Remove xx's from address to reply
Marc Dashevsky
2005-08-30 02:03:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mark Dintenfass
Post by Marc Dashevsky
Post by Delbert Stanley
I see where PBS is showing a two-parter on early Dylan next
month (Sept. 27 & 28th?). It is part of the American Masters
series. It is directed by Martin Scorsese. Maybe additional
details will be revealed. Probably not, however.
Detail like this? <http://pbs.org/previews/american_masters_dylan>
Thanks for posting this. I'll certainly be watching, though I wish it
were going to cover two or three more years after 1966.
I don't know yet if I'll be watching. I love Scorsese's "regular"
films, but I have cringed watching his fawning THE LAST WALTZ and
his overromanticized FEEL LIKE GOING HOME, his contribution to the
PBS series, THE BLUES.
--
Go to http://MarcDashevsky.com to send me e-mail.
(Reunion -- http://ClassicalHigh70.com)
MSP
2005-08-30 16:27:56 UTC
Permalink
A lovely exotic little thing
MSP
Post by DianeE
Post by b***@yahoo.com
What did Bob Dylan mean by saying "Siamese Cat" in "Like a Rolling
Stone"?
------------
The Siamese is a small breed, ergo more likely to fit on a human shoulder.
DianeE
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